My daughter's tragedy: U.S. health care in a nutshell.

It's the actual cost of your health insurance. The $300 or $500 or whatever you pay / month isn't the full premium.

It's been the employer subsidy that have shielded employees from knowing how expensive their health insurance actually is. I retired early due to health concerns and started paying $750 a month four years ago. Each year the cost has risen $100 a month and now four years later I pay $1,127 per month. Add deductibles and copays, dental care and prescription drugs my cost is $18,000 a year. Imagine paying the cost of a new car every year for health care. No wonder no one in this country can afford anything except housing, electricity, fuel, groceries and health insurance. It is a national disgrace.

Wowzer. When I was laid off in 2002 my Cobra bill was $450/month. I am a single female with no dependents.

By the looks of this email, it appears the costs have skyrocketed by 100%+

We have to do something, but what, I have no freaking clue.

By the looks of this email, it appears the costs have skyrocketed by 100%+

Sounds about right. Most people I've talked to have been quoted rates around $1000/month, depending on age and level of coverage. (You can get some cheaper plans, with at least a $2000 deductible, which means that coverage will only kick in if you have a major health incident.)

I'm single and my COBRA w/o ARRA is $542 per month. If I don't find a job before my COBRA expires, I'm fracked. I'm uninsurable otherwise.

Insurance companies, health care companies and pharmaceutical companies screw everyone and the government knows it. These companies make a lot of money from the suffering of people. Do these companies have a need to cure cancer and other diseases? Of course not. How would doctors and these companies make money if all diseases were cured? It's similar to the car companies not making cars that get better gas mileage. Better gas mileage, less gas sold, therefore less profits for the oil companies and less tax for the government.

Money is the root of all evil...

You realize that right now the gov. will cover 65% of your Cobra, you guys all really need to do some research, I have insurance and even know that. I think that the gov. should regulate health insurance more but not run it, atleast regulations would get the costs down right now.

These companies make a lot of money from the suffering of people. Do these companies have a need to cure cancer and other diseases? Of course not. How would doctors and these companies make money if all diseases were cured?

Exactly, this is one of the scariest parts of our system. How many medicines aren't developed because they aren't "profitable".

Exactly, this is one of the scariest parts of our system. How many medicines aren't developed because they aren't "profitable".

The cure for cancer is probably sitting in a warehouse in Baltimore somewhere... along with the formula for cold fusion.

We have to hold the President and the Democratic Congress feet to the fire. The American people are overwhelmingly open to the public plan as an option. The insurance companies are spending $1.4 million a day with their anti reform messages but too many people know how abusive and costly the current system is. We have to keep the pressure up to the boiling point that if this is not done, the Democrats will have a short lived majority. Our Congressman and Senators know that our votes are riding on this.

The president is the one who is trying to reform health care! I don't think he is the problem. It is the lobbyist for the insurance industry that is the problem! These guys should be in the Smithsonian. The government should truly be for the people....

I truly believe the president wants to do the right thing but he still needs our pushing to keep his commitment strong in the light a strong lobbying effort to forget the public option.

what total crap, I have ins thru state farm, my own with a deductible of 5000. I guess youd call it major medical. I pay for my families doctor visits and dental checkups, but if something major should happen Im covered. For me and my wife its 189.11 a month. Now how bad really is insurance and I pick my own doctor !!!

The love of money, are the people that provide us our jobs. They are the ones that take the risk so that they can have and start companies. We all benefit from the people that love money, not everyone that works hard and wants more are bad immoral people.

bigboy-If you develop diabetes, cancer, heart disease, etc, State Farm will either drop you or you won't be able to afford the increase in premiums. Good luck.

bigboyj, take the time to check your policy for any caps on your coverage. Your premium sounds suspicious, even with the high deductible.

Of course it is. It would be a lot harder for right-wingers to peddle all of their self-righteous BS if they just admitted what they really thought: they don't care who suffers as long as it's someone else.

it always amazes me how unempathetic so many universal health opponents can be in regard to this volatile issue. they might as well kick the person lying in the street bleeding as they walk over them. i never understood how the 'compassionate conservative' comes into play with their selfish mentality as compassion seems to be missing from their vocab. it seems people with that kind of narrow minded approach only take action when they are adversely effected. some people just value their wallet over human sympathy and change is just too scary for them

'compassionate conservative'

I've heard about them, but never met one-must be a very rare animal.

i heard they were out to pasture with the rest of the gop possibly on the endangered species list ;)

Actually, I believe some insurance carriers have changed the rules to include children living at home until the age of 26 regardless of student status. My insurance made this change several months ago-probably because of the health care reform debate. Or maybe, the insurance companies have figured out that they can collect premiums on young, healthy adults that wouldn't otherwise buy insurance.

Or maybe, the insurance companies have figured out that they can collect premiums on young, healthy adults that wouldn't otherwise buy insurance.

probably.

I wouldn't be surprised trm2008.

I think what I posted is more of a general rule, but in truth alot of people dont really know what really is the truth because the people who provide this coverage are to vague in what they really have to offer.

And when you end up complaining about this, they always to seem to have the magic backdoor to get out of this dilema.

its sad that children dont have or cant get insurance... oh wait or can they... what the hell is KCHIP for... children !!! please people there is so many ways kids and grown up alike can get help... we do not need govt sponcerd health care. they cannot even run their own businees properly, do you think we need them running yours !!!

One of my friends had a similar dilemma he graduated college this year and has enlisted in the army for the next 3 years to get his benefits, decent pay, housing, something he always wanted to do, and figures in 3 years there will be a better job market.

My husbands brother is in his last year of college for biotech, and was offered by the gov. to go to school for free while getting paid 60,000$ a year if he will work for them for a certain amount of time when he gets out of school. He obviously took the offer.

what the hell is KCHIP for

You do realize that the CHIP programs are a government run program don't you? A lot of these programs (depending on the state) disqualify you once you turn 18. Potentially someone could be dropped from the program while still in high school.

Your situation is heartbreaking. I wish you the best.

What industry do you work in, and where in the US? It's possible one of us on the Vine might be able to recommend something for you.

You are not alone. If I got on disability, I wouldn't get enough to pay all of my medicine. I could live without some of it. However, I would live a miserable life without all of it.

wow, I can't believe that things like this are even happening. I truly wish you the best and I wish that there was something I could do to help.

The only advice I have is to do all the research you can on any other options that might be available to you.

Please, update us on your situation. I really hope that everything works out for you!

Interesting read.

It's hard to not blame the guys who do this to people, but I guess you kind of lose your soul in a way by working for the company. When they see reports, all they see is numbers or statistics.

There is no face, no profile, no story of each indidual people.

Its like when people see on the news that people died in a tornado. They say, 3 people died, not unusual, but then you dont get to know thoose people, they are just statistics and numbers.

This guy got a serious wake up call when he saw that what he does behind a nice office desk, effects a lot of real people. Like for some of us, who have a brain freeze eating ice cream when for sick people, they feel that pain 24/7 and need serious medication to get them by.

Sad tragedy but true.

No kidding. His candidness was refreshing. No partisan nonsense. Just straight to the point.

I can vouch for your general point. A few months ago, I did a youth gang prevention training for some local community organizations. I brought up the topic of limited recreational activities and job opportunities for teens in the urban core. Several members of the audience commented that this topic was part of the problem because it gave teens the right to blame their behavior on something else, such as a lack of alternative opportunities.

A few hours later, I brought in some teens from the urban core who had been involved with some prominent gangs. One young man talked about applying for 15 jobs in the last three weeks and being turned down for all of them (mostly remedial jobs, still no luck). He talked about not being allowed to participate in school activities and not having a safe park to play basketball at. Soon, several members of the audience were offering help, giving job leads and solutions to the problem.

I closed the discussion by pointing out to everyone that the same young man they were just trying to help was the same young man they were ridiculing a few hours before when the topic of alternative opportunities came up. The only difference was now they had seen his face and had been given a tangible window into his struggle.

As you pointed out, it doesn't matter to people who have no frame of reference. We play the blame game; push the responsible off on someone else so we can act like it's not our problem. How truly unfortunate.

I saw that interview, it was eye-opening. I don't understand why someone would trust a for-profit insurance company to decide what is best for their health.

Because they are deseperate for a solution.

Can't afford treatment? Go away and die quietly.

Which is what many will do.

I heard a commercial this week about coverage for families with Autism. This condition is rapidly increasing in families... it is expensive too. Some agencies will not cover.

I dont think it really takes much to make a generic painkiller, they just turn a hefty profit because the demand is so high for it, that they charge a higher rate and get more money because they have medicine.

Business wise, its a excellent way to make profit.

Ethics wise, it's sick, because the people who needs this stuff, really need it.

I don't want to know what they would cost to be honest, but even with coverage and buying them at the stores I work for.... it all adds up.

Lisinopril 90 day supply= $14

Glipizide 90 day supply =$14

Metformin 90 day supply = $14

Actos 90 day supply =$120.00

That does not even cover the cost of the test strips ($20+)

Firewitch... I don't envy your situation, that has to be hard to live with day to day. Does your son have Aspberger's? You said a form of? My brother who is now 37 is autistic, and was diagnosed in 76. He has been on the state since 1980.

Considering how much drug companies spend on advertising, and I'm sure lobbying, I have a feeling they can cut some of those costs and lower prices a bit.

Ironic how we tout the drug companies for their magical ability to cure us and gladly shun those who refuse to pay their high prices, but everyone please take note that almost EVERY SINGLE disease for which we have a cure or vaccine for in the 20th century in America was developed and created in University labs, mostly by NIH funded scientists, not Bayer or Pfizer.

So, if we really want to heal America with pills, push to get more NIH funding for our Universities. That, coupled with a public option (or outright single payer) will get us toward a truly world-beating healthcare system.

Firewitch... I don't envy your situation, that has to be hard to live with day to day. Does your son have Aspberger's? You said a form of? My brother who is now 37 is autistic, and was diagnosed in 76. He has been on the state since 1980.

Yes he does DragonWoman . It's hard to deal with but you do what you can for your loved ones. Our state ,Washington, is trying to deal with the budget! I am glad your brother has you to help.

I wonder what our gov. is going to do with our budget as well.... how long will the gravey train last????

This is a mess

I wish you well Firewitch.

I wish my employer-subsidized insurance would go back to co-pay. My deductible is $2500. You save on premiums, but you can't afford to go to the doctor. Unless something major happens, the insurance company can be pretty sure they will get to pocket your premiums and pay nothing out. What a racket.

How can this be? How can the same procedure cost less for someone who is financially more sound, and $3000 more for an individual who most likely won't be able to pay?

I've had the same experience for some surgery years ago, but the insurance company actually only paid 1/3 of the original bill amount. I owed nothing. The only way I can get that to make sense is that they charge the insurance company what it really costs. For uninsured people they figure that half or two-thirds of people can't afford to pay, so they charge the rest double or triple to try to make up for it.

How can this be? How can the same procedure cost less for someone who is financially more sound, and $3000 more for an individual who most likely won't be able to pay?

This is how insurance companies operate. I see bills from my insurance all the time - they call it "explanation of payments" - they usually pay around half of doctors charges, according to their rates. But if you want to pay cash - you'll be paying the entire balance.

My mom works in the legal department of a major insurance company.... they see this crap all the time.

I fell off a bunk back in college. The hospital insisted on pregnancy test when I said it was impossible for there to be one... and then charged me for a set of crutches I never received. My student insurance was to cover everything, but they sent me the bill accidentally. When I called the hospital I explained the situation to them and they got all.... "don't worry, we will contact your insurance company" I never heard a thing again.

The hospital will incurwhat ever money they need any way they can... someone who does not pay attention, may find themselves covering someone's charges.

It's not Jedipunk's family it's a seed from DailyKos.

The profit of insurance companies at the cost of human suffering is obscene. There are some things that should not be bought and sold. Human flesh is one. For-profit insurance is just another form of trafficking and it should stop.

I say everyone without insurance should just go to the emergency room to get their care. You don't have to pay up front. When the hospital sends the bill, just toss it in the garbage. Problem settled-health care for everyone. (sarcasm)

Sorry, Beckyal-you are already paying for other people's health care through increased insurance premiums and higher medical bills.

Our country needs to take the burden of providing health insurance off of businesses. It hurts their competitiveness, and chains employees to their jobs. Health care should be a right, not a privilege.

But it is not my responsibility to pay for other peoples who are not a member of my family. My taxes all ready do enough of that.

/facepalm

Yes, and I'm sure you've never benefited from anyone else's tax dollars. Ever.

Yes, and I'm sure you've never benefited from anyone else's tax dollars. Ever.

Certainly not. Not in clean air or water or roads or perhaps a student loan or anything like that. No. Never. This person lives independent of everyone else in every single respect. He is a rock. He is an island.

:::cough:::

Jarrod - I suggest ignoring 17 year old MatB who knows nothing but says just a whole lot.

You must have great insurance.

Mat, I am sure, has mommy and daddy taking care of his insurance. He doesn't need to chose between a monthly healthcare bill and rent/mortgage.

MatB

Read the contract before you sign geniuses.

Two huge problems with this sophomoric statement

1) Any contract with 'pre-existing conditions' language is ripe for broad intepretation. Good luck finding ANY insurance company without some type of interpretable clause in it.

2) In the event that an insurance company falsely denies your claim, you can't do much about it. You're forced to get an attorney to fight that insurance company in court. Most often, the legal battle ends up being more expensive than he claim itself. Thus, it becomes a profitable business plan for insurance companies to deny claims because it lowers their overhead costs and increases their profits......at the expense of the customer, who quite often has no recourse action.

If you truly aren't just a troll and/or a political hack, you should really watch the interview I posted in # 8.

Otherwise, you may end up making a fool of yourself without knowing it ;)

MatB

More sophomoric statements.

1) New cancer developments can be viewed as 'pre-existing conditions' if someone in your family has had the same cancer. Happens all the time.

2) The people going bankrupt because of medical bills typically aren't going bankrupt because of strep throat or the flu

3) Again, most people simply don't have the resources to bring about a suit. It costs money and time to do that. Most attorneys won't take a case pro bono unless it is a guaranteed win and unless there is a large potential payout for them.

I have to ask what your basing your opinion on? I've cited a few sources throughout.....none of which you probably bothered to read.

troll

I know what I know. I know the system works for most of us. And that our country produces all the new treatments.

It's funny that most of the drug companies are now owned by foreign companies. LOL

I take one drug that was developed over 40 years ago in a foreign country. Several years before I started taking it, a drug company found that this drug could be used for my illness. When I started taking this medicine 12 years ago, it cost $750 per month. Now, it costs $2,250 per month. This medicine just slows down the progression of the disease and is not 100% effective.

I wish I had invented it!

This troll is just as bad as Sarah Palin. Neither one will go away.

so I say at what time in Americas legacy did it become evil to make a profit...

MatB won't reply to this because he does not understand it.

bigboyj

The problem is that a profit is now being made through the means of unethical practice. An insurance company denying a claim that they know they should pay simply because it makes them more money to do so is unethical and immoral. It has NEVER been in the American Legacy to screw people over in order to make a quick buck. If you think that this is a concept that this nation should be built around, I pity you and the nation.

Please pull up the constitution and find for me the section that deals with healtcare right.... please... Im waiting !!!

Even if health care is a right you realize it is not free. If you want to go to your local midwife call her up the next time you have a baby to deliver it, that is what americans used to do for cheap/free health care. Good health care costs more money. Native Americans had medicine doctors why don't you do your research and become one and treat your village, that's what would be free. Go grow and pick some herbs to treat yourself. I agree that the health care industry needs to be regulated more but going to the hospital and seeing a doctor for free is not a right. You do realize that the gov. plan americans still have to pay for and then their will be more lobbying and our politicians taking even more advantage.

Jessicaf,

Our government can be brutally efficient when it needs to, or wants to. Consider the fact that our government planned, staged and carried out two major invasions and has continuing warfare on two fronts. It moved billions of dollars in equipment and soldiers in a very small span of time, and continues to move, plan and anticipate more wars with Iran and North Korea. When we gear up we, as a nation, can and do move mountains.

The problem is a matter of will and adherence to a failing ideology. As was pointed out above, the market-economy mindset rules at this point, and unless health care delivery can provide a profit to rich investors that delivery will not happen. The rich have a quite different take on this subject and the woes of the uninsured simply do not interest them one whit. There are no faces or families visible on a balance sheet.

We bandy a lot of words and numbers about, but when it actually comes down to it, the stories of desolation and despair are what should move government, not the potential for lost or diminished profits. Certainly making a profit is an acceptable goal for a company, but the health of the nation is simply more important than corporate bottom lines. There are dozens of operational examples of how national/universal health care can be accomplished. Once we get the will to do it.

when has our government EVER been efficient with tax dollars????????????????? for god's sake, the national healthcare (medicare/caid) coverage they have now is a disaster! And they want to put EVERYONE on it??? oh that'll help.... not!

What our government cannot do is make lazy, irresponsible people into people who are worth enough on the global market to pay for their health care. We are a net importer of oil and basic necessities; we must export something to import anything, including medical supplies. These kind of people are worth nothing in the global economy, it is impossible to give them enough "free" stuff like health care or food or a house to make them into valuable citizens. They are a drain on our nation, driving into collective poverty.

A perosn who has no self-restraint or moral strength is never going to be able to make ends meet. If you give them 1 million in free stimulus funds, they will be in debt in a year anyhow, but with lots of waste to show for it.

We don't need to give our laziest people free health care, we need to export them body and complaining soul to some other country. We need an emigration program to go with our immigration program - for each immigrant we take from another country, one of our entitled, lazy, selfish, arrogant little wastrels is forced to go to that country. Thus our national economy will improve.

thank you for the insight, I do not think that people understand how great our care is in the US. We pay more for better care, in other countries preventive care and people with more serious conditions get swept under the rug because it costs the gov. too much money. I have never heard of turner syndrome and have begun to look it up, thanks for enlightening me, I am happy they came up with a good payment plan and that your daughter will be getting the best care.

oh thanks so I will pay for a national health plan and still pay my private insurer, wonderful.

jedi--so if I chose the "option" of keeping my private insurance, do I still have to pay for YOUR national health plan?

This push-back is amazing to me. These people seem not to care one whit that a healthy population creates a healthy, more productive country. There seems to be no concern for fellow human beings, only for what they pay and what they get. To hell with everyone else. Very disturbing.

If he's uninsured, the taxpayers are already footing the bill.

Kid, you haven't the vaguest idea how things actually work. You really need to educate yourself. Emergency Rooms cannot refuse to provide critical care. So for uninsured people, they get no medical care until it's critical, and they wind up in the ER. When they can't pay, we do.

MatB, this is from your own article:

Ladies and gentlemen, people die in wars.
No one likes to admit it, no one likes to see it, but people die.

Reality check: Twenty thousand Americans die each year for lack of health insurance. Yes, people die...but not only in wars.

It's not about refusing care. It's people who know something is wrong with them physically but they don't go to the doctor because they can't afford it or are afraid they won't be able to afford tests and treatment. Consequently, they become seriously ill and die when they may have survived had they had care when they needed it.

Aside from that reason, people have died on the floors and lawns of hospitals. It's not a pretty world we live in.

Second, a good amount of the time, by the time you know something's wrong with things like cancer, unless you catch the lump early on, you're a dead man anyways. Sorry, life sucks, cancer kills.

People with insurance can get regular check-ups, and catch it early while it's still treatable. People without insurance end up like you said.

Also, Dave, sometimes, cancer just kills you.

And sometimes it doesn't. If treated early it usually doesn't. I will say to you once again: educate yourself. Most cancers have very high survival rates, if caught early. When people do not have insurance, and don't get regular check-ups, it doesnt get caught early.

MatB wrote:

First, there are lots of free Clinics run by the Catholic Church mostly that will at very least test you.

It's a lot easier to get to the hospital than it is to find your local free clinic. Do you know where your closest free clinic is? I don't.

Second, a good amount of the time, by the time you know something's wrong with things like cancer, unless you catch the lump early on, you're a dead man anyways. Sorry, life sucks, cancer kills.

You're talking to a cancer survivor. No, cancer doesn't have to kill. It nearly killed me because...

Third: some doctors are stupid.

...yes, my primary care doctor was stupid. I had a 25cm tumor in my chest and he diagnosed me as having post-nasal drip and sinus infection. I was in the hospital having heart surgery and receiving chemo three days after that diagnosis because I saw an oncologist.

I know, but saying 20,000 when some of them would have died anyways is just dumb.

That's a cynical thought. We should just ignore the 20,000 because some would have died anyway? What if you were in that group? Are you ready to die because you can't afford healthcare? Is life that cheap these days?

ashamed of someone who is worried about HIS AND HIS FAMILY'S LIVELIHOOD over having to provide someone with government healthcare? I'm not ashamed of him. I feel his pain. I am more worried about MY DAUGHTER GETTING CARE than a bunch of other people getting care that I pay for and that will result in my daughter getting LESS care. Forgive me for not being a bleeding heart liberal. I take care of my own first and when I'm forced to take care of you too, I get a little bit pissed. Especially when it means my daughter is not going to get the EXCELLENT CARE that she has been getting (some of which I've had to pay out of pocket for).

You realize that many companies are hurting right now and most restaurants only make money because of how little their employee overhead is, waitresses get paid around 2.50$ an hour. So to provide your staff with health care would quickly put many restaurants out of business. Then these people will not have health insurance or a job. This does not make him scum, he carries a huge risk from running a business and an even higher risk in this economy he just doesn't want to go out of business. So sick of the name calling and hate over different opinions. If companies are required to provide health care there prices would have to rise significantly and would put them out of business. You get paid by how much you make your employer the more money your employer makes off of you the more likely you will have health insurance benefits and better pay. I think in Mass if you have over 12 full time employees you are supposed to provide some type of insurance, usually the insurance will still cost the employee over 400$ a month though.